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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 6:44 pm 
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catbear wrote:
That's essentially it, my aunt will complain about Obamacare and creeping socialism and then praise the way Ireland looks after their old folks. I think she's thinks its all just a catholic church run thing as she left Ireland in the 50s.


Those views are that 20-25% crazy cracker base of the GOP. Until the 70's most of the benefits of the new deal/redistributive state went to white people almost exclusively, e.g. African Americans barely benefited from the GI bill as so many colleges didn't accept black applicants, that's one example but there are many. The tea party/Trumpist politics of the base are tied up with racism and the changing face of the country's politics and demographics, the 'undeserving' are the real problem, not the idea of a redistributive state. Outside Silicon Valley libertarian ideas are really very marginal. Obama represents all of these anxieties wrapped up in individual form, the 'black body in the white house', as it were.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:05 pm 
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satechi wrote:

Nope I've been to both countries while the US has its shares of problems it may as well be on a different planet when compared to the shithole that Russia is, the propaganda on Russian TV is something that would have made Joseph Goebbels proud, nowadays your average Russian (that hasnt emigrated) actually believes the "West" is out to rape their country and there is a worldwide conspiracy against them and their country.


I know few Russian engineers/technicians here and they all think that everyone is against Russia. Some of them laughed when they watched Ukraine crisis on different TV stations.
Comparisons between: Ukrainian vs Russian or Western vs Russian were really funny according to them.

All were totally opposite, as they all lie: BBC, CNBC, CNN, Fox News or RT. It does not matter, there is always some agenda behind. You can't watch 1 source and think its all true.
RT is special, as Russian language and culture is specific, it is not English, but Russian-English hybrid.

_________________
Why it was so windy there?... I am out.

For future reference, a 'soft landing' theorem:
06/2007: Central Bank predicts soft landing for housing
http://www.independent.ie/business/iris ... 96858.html
It's all grand


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:12 pm 
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mightyz wrote:
satechi wrote:

Nope I've been to both countries while the US has its shares of problems it may as well be on a different planet when compared to the shithole that Russia is, the propaganda on Russian TV is something that would have made Joseph Goebbels proud, nowadays your average Russian (that hasnt emigrated) actually believes the "West" is out to rape their country and there is a worldwide conspiracy against them and their country.


I know few Russian engineers/technicians here and they all think that everyone is against Russia. Some of them laughed when they watched Ukraine crisis on different TV stations.
Comparisons between: Ukrainian vs Russian or Western vs Russian were really funny according to them.

All were totally opposite, as they all lie: BBC, CNBC, CNN, Fox News or RT. It does not matter, there is always some agenda behind. You can't watch 1 source and think its all true.
RT is special, as Russian language and culture is specific, it is not English, but Russian-English hybrid.


Oddly enough, an Israeli friend of mine (who lives in the US) swears by Al-Jazeera.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 10:43 pm 
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Too Big to Fail

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Posts: 4081
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mr_anderson wrote:
mightyz wrote:
satechi wrote:

Nope I've been to both countries while the US has its shares of problems it may as well be on a different planet when compared to the shithole that Russia is, the propaganda on Russian TV is something that would have made Joseph Goebbels proud, nowadays your average Russian (that hasnt emigrated) actually believes the "West" is out to rape their country and there is a worldwide conspiracy against them and their country.


I know few Russian engineers/technicians here and they all think that everyone is against Russia. Some of them laughed when they watched Ukraine crisis on different TV stations.
Comparisons between: Ukrainian vs Russian or Western vs Russian were really funny according to them.

All were totally opposite, as they all lie: BBC, CNBC, CNN, Fox News or RT. It does not matter, there is always some agenda behind. You can't watch 1 source and think its all true.
RT is special, as Russian language and culture is specific, it is not English, but Russian-English hybrid.




Oddly enough, an Israeli friend of mine (who lives in the US) swears by Al-Jazeera.

AJ is not bad in the US, certainly their online SF stuff is good on housing and consumer debt. But heads up to posters who have discovered media bias, there is a field called media criticism that's been around for about 50 years which studies that phenomenon! And RT is not actually for a Russian audience, that's why it's in English/Arabic/Spanish. It's not a Russian English hybrid, Larry King and Assange present programs after all. Always interesting that the Kremlin is so closely associated with descriptions of RT when we never hear how BBC is 'Whitehall owned'. To each his own bias.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:30 pm 
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Joined: Jul 10, 2009
Posts: 2240
catbear wrote:
Scratcher wrote:
yoganmahew wrote:
Scratcher wrote:
It's glaringly obvious what my original point was.

:(

Whataboutery? :?


OP says RT is biased against US, I say US media is biased against Russia. But please go on, keep talking, you were saying - Fox News....

Fox news is anti-everyone!

Its target audience is the frightened, the belligerent, the frail and the disgruntled. Half its audience are over 65. I have an retired aunt in Florida who's hooked to it, she told my wife on the phone that if Saunders gets elected then he'll bring socialism to America and she'll have to move back to ireland!


I thought they already had socialism. I bet h's going to take away guns and set up FEMA camps too.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 1:14 am 
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ditch dweller wrote:
AJ is not bad in the US, certainly their online SF stuff is good on housing and consumer debt. But heads up to posters who have discovered media bias, there is a field called media criticism that's been around for about 50 years which studies that phenomenon! And RT is not actually for a Russian audience, that's why it's in English/Arabic/Spanish. It's not a Russian English hybrid, Larry King and Assange present programs after all. Always interesting that the Kremlin is so closely associated with descriptions of RT when we never hear how BBC is 'Whitehall owned'. To each his own bias.

Topically enough, the BBC just carried a report tonight from some shitehole near Novosibirsk. The locals were complaining about the economy and local corruption. The Beeb were there to marvel at how the people -- traditionally respectful "of Tsar or President" -- were taking to the streets. The somewhat condescending undertone was that things must be really bad if these peaceable people were demonstrating.

Then the BBC reporters started getting harassed by local news outlets, questioned by police, and followed everywhere they went. A local news channel carried a report about how things were bad everywhere including the West, carrying pictures of a rundown English tourist town called Jaywick.

I've no doubt the BBC has a pro-Western agenda. But I think comparisons with the paranoid pro-Putin media in Russia are beyond laughable. The BBC were actually on location talking to locals and have been there for a week or two. People they've spoken to have been threatened by local officials and the police. When I checked where Jaywick was (in Essex, near Clacton-on-Sea), it was instantly obvious that the Novosibirsk media's pictures were taken straight off a Google maps search.

RT content is regularly more fantastical than Fox News (which is not, as far as I know, a mouthpiece of any government). Like Fox, some of their anchors and reporters are clearly batshit crazy, or brainwashed. It's somewhere in between fascinating and cringeworthy to watch.

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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 6:38 am 
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ps200306 wrote:
ditch dweller wrote:
AJ is not bad in the US, certainly their online SF stuff is good on housing and consumer debt. But heads up to posters who have discovered media bias, there is a field called media criticism that's been around for about 50 years which studies that phenomenon! And RT is not actually for a Russian audience, that's why it's in English/Arabic/Spanish. It's not a Russian English hybrid, Larry King and Assange present programs after all. Always interesting that the Kremlin is so closely associated with descriptions of RT when we never hear how BBC is 'Whitehall owned'. To each his own bias.

Topically enough, the BBC just carried a report tonight from some shitehole near Novosibirsk. The locals were complaining about the economy and local corruption. The Beeb were there to marvel at how the people -- traditionally respectful "of Tsar or President" -- were taking to the streets. The somewhat condescending undertone was that things must be really bad if these peaceable people were demonstrating.

Then the BBC reporters started getting harassed by local news outlets, questioned by police, and followed everywhere they went. A local news channel carried a report about how things were bad everywhere including the West, carrying pictures of a rundown English tourist town called Jaywick.

I've no doubt the BBC has a pro-Western agenda. But I think comparisons with the paranoid pro-Putin media in Russia are beyond laughable. The BBC were actually on location talking to locals and have been there for a week or two. People they've spoken to have been threatened by local officials and the police. When I checked where Jaywick was (in Essex, near Clacton-on-Sea), it was instantly obvious that the Novosibirsk media's pictures were taken straight off a Google maps search.

RT content is regularly more fantastical than Fox News (which is not, as far as I know, a mouthpiece of any government). Like Fox, some of their anchors and reporters are clearly batshit crazy, or brainwashed. It's somewhere in between fascinating and cringeworthy to watch.


Yeah, RT is Alex Jones with a big budget and a degree. They stop short of Lizard People but not by much, and there are bazillions of writers and journalists out there who parrot any kind of conspiracy crap to get attention, whether they believe it or not is secondary. I've even seen straight anti-semitic conspiracies reported on there, shameless. There is an Irish guy who reports regularly for RT whose stuff I discovered as it is posted on here (quel surprise), makes a bit of sense for 90 seconds and then...nonsense. RT is naked propaganda and is a tactical tool of the Russian state, the BBC is a genuine media orgainsation, has been at it longer and is more strategic in it's relationship with Britain. But it has an important political role in terms of the interests of the UK and is a willing ally of the state.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 2:35 pm 
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Joined: Jan 28, 2013
Posts: 1336
mightyz wrote:
satechi wrote:

Nope I've been to both countries while the US has its shares of problems it may as well be on a different planet when compared to the shithole that Russia is, the propaganda on Russian TV is something that would have made Joseph Goebbels proud, nowadays your average Russian (that hasnt emigrated) actually believes the "West" is out to rape their country and there is a worldwide conspiracy against them and their country.


I know few Russian engineers/technicians here and they all think that everyone is against Russia. Some of them laughed when they watched Ukraine crisis on different TV stations.
Comparisons between: Ukrainian vs Russian or Western vs Russian were really funny according to them.

All were totally opposite, as they all lie: BBC, CNBC, CNN, Fox News or RT. It does not matter, there is always some agenda behind. You can't watch 1 source and think its all true.
RT is special, as Russian language and culture is specific, it is not English, but Russian-English hybrid.



Exactly my point. However, this thread is populated by US cheerleaders so it's pointless trying to point out the obvious hypocrisy to them. They say the first casualty of war is the truth, this is completely apparent in Western media accounts of Palestine, Syria, Iraq, Libya etc. The reporting and spin is shameful. BBC might be 'less bad' but at the end of the day I don't trust it any more than any other station. But see what you want to see and hear what you want to hear, to really learn the truth you have to dig far beyond the media.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 4:50 pm 
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Joined: Sep 13, 2007
Posts: 31626
Location: Tullamore
Scratcher wrote:
mightyz wrote:
satechi wrote:

Nope I've been to both countries while the US has its shares of problems it may as well be on a different planet when compared to the shithole that Russia is, the propaganda on Russian TV is something that would have made Joseph Goebbels proud, nowadays your average Russian (that hasnt emigrated) actually believes the "West" is out to rape their country and there is a worldwide conspiracy against them and their country.


I know few Russian engineers/technicians here and they all think that everyone is against Russia. Some of them laughed when they watched Ukraine crisis on different TV stations.
Comparisons between: Ukrainian vs Russian or Western vs Russian were really funny according to them.

All were totally opposite, as they all lie: BBC, CNBC, CNN, Fox News or RT. It does not matter, there is always some agenda behind. You can't watch 1 source and think its all true.
RT is special, as Russian language and culture is specific, it is not English, but Russian-English hybrid.


Exactly my point. However, this thread is populated by US cheerleaders so it's pointless trying to point out the obvious hypocrisy to them. They say the first casualty of war is the truth, this is completely apparent in Western media accounts of Palestine, Syria, Iraq, Libya etc. The reporting and spin is shameful. BBC might be 'less bad' but at the end of the day I don't trust it any more than any other station. But see what you want to see and hear what you want to hear, to really learn the truth you have to dig far beyond the media.

Cheerleaders? Are you shitting me? Nobody is telling you to trust the media. You are under the delusion that RT is fair, balanced and normal and just the same as everyone else. Others here are trying to disabuse you of that notion, but feel free to be happily codded by out-and-out designed propaganda.

_________________
"It is impossible to design a system so perfect that no one needs to be good."

So long and thanks for all the fish.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 4:58 pm 
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Posts: 262
Ive watched a couple of videos of RT Reporter Gayane Chichakyan question John Kirby spokesperson for the white house about the Syrian conflict and she has wiped the floor with him on every occasion.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 6:46 pm 
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Property Magnate

Joined: Jan 4, 2012
Posts: 589
Devilsbit wrote:
Ive watched a couple of videos of RT Reporter Gayane Chichakyan question John Kirby spokesperson for the white house about the Syrian conflict and she has wiped the floor with him on every occasion.

Agreed, she has a good understanding of global affairs and asks pertinent questions with perseverance.
I like that RT canvass people like Noam Chomsky and John Pilger for their opinions on current issues too. Their views don't seem to be widely disseminated by western outlets.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:22 pm 
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Joined: Jan 28, 2013
Posts: 1336
yoganmahew wrote:
Scratcher wrote:
mightyz wrote:
satechi wrote:

Nope I've been to both countries while the US has its shares of problems it may as well be on a different planet when compared to the shithole that Russia is, the propaganda on Russian TV is something that would have made Joseph Goebbels proud, nowadays your average Russian (that hasnt emigrated) actually believes the "West" is out to rape their country and there is a worldwide conspiracy against them and their country.


I know few Russian engineers/technicians here and they all think that everyone is against Russia. Some of them laughed when they watched Ukraine crisis on different TV stations.
Comparisons between: Ukrainian vs Russian or Western vs Russian were really funny according to them.

All were totally opposite, as they all lie: BBC, CNBC, CNN, Fox News or RT. It does not matter, there is always some agenda behind. You can't watch 1 source and think its all true.
RT is special, as Russian language and culture is specific, it is not English, but Russian-English hybrid.


Exactly my point. However, this thread is populated by US cheerleaders so it's pointless trying to point out the obvious hypocrisy to them. They say the first casualty of war is the truth, this is completely apparent in Western media accounts of Palestine, Syria, Iraq, Libya etc. The reporting and spin is shameful. BBC might be 'less bad' but at the end of the day I don't trust it any more than any other station. But see what you want to see and hear what you want to hear, to really learn the truth you have to dig far beyond the media.

Cheerleaders? Are you shitting me? Nobody is telling you to trust the media. You are under the delusion that RT is fair, balanced and normal and just the same as everyone else. Others here are trying to disabuse you of that notion, but feel free to be happily codded by out-and-out designed propaganda.



I don't think you are the full shilling mate, I never said any of that. Frankly your posts seem to be predatory in nature and trollish at best. For the record, I have no unique respect for the Russian Administration or RT.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 8:27 pm 
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Posts: 31626
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Scratcher wrote:
satechi wrote:
evilcart wrote:
I don't get why people listen to those crazy doomsayers. That dude in the video is talking bollox , pure hairy balls bullshit.


The whole purpose of Russia Today is to paint a grim picture of the "West" as all gloom and doom, while the Motherland is put into glorious white light.

Its just one cog in a wider and disturbingly efficient propaganda machine used by Russia to keep its Russian speaking sheep in line


Ain't that exactly what the yanks do??

I'll quote just one back at you Scratcher. You started with saying that the US is a propaganda machine used by the US government to keep its sheep in line.

I don't believe that to be the case, not in comparison to RT, anyway.

_________________
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So long and thanks for all the fish.


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:24 pm 
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Joined: Jan 4, 2012
Posts: 589
yoganmahew wrote:
Scratcher wrote:
satechi wrote:
evilcart wrote:
I don't get why people listen to those crazy doomsayers. That dude in the video is talking bollox , pure hairy balls bullshit.


The whole purpose of Russia Today is to paint a grim picture of the "West" as all gloom and doom, while the Motherland is put into glorious white light.

Its just one cog in a wider and disturbingly efficient propaganda machine used by Russia to keep its Russian speaking sheep in line


Ain't that exactly what the yanks do??

I'll quote just one back at you Scratcher. You started with saying that the US is a propaganda machine used by the US government to keep its sheep in line.

I don't believe that to be the case, not in comparison to RT, anyway.


Whatever about RT as one single news organisation there is undoubtedly bias in the media in every country.
This was a very interesting article on media misrepresentation of the Syrian civil war
https://news.brown.edu/bitn/2016/02/media-are-misleading-public-syria


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 Post subject: Re: US, up up up
PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2016 12:42 am 
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Joined: Jan 28, 2013
Posts: 1336
yoganmahew wrote:
Scratcher wrote:
satechi wrote:
evilcart wrote:
I don't get why people listen to those crazy doomsayers. That dude in the video is talking bollox , pure hairy balls bullshit.


The whole purpose of Russia Today is to paint a grim picture of the "West" as all gloom and doom, while the Motherland is put into glorious white light.

Its just one cog in a wider and disturbingly efficient propaganda machine used by Russia to keep its Russian speaking sheep in line


Ain't that exactly what the yanks do??

I'll quote just one back at you Scratcher. You started with saying that the US is a propaganda machine used by the US government to keep its sheep in line.

I don't believe that to be the case, not in comparison to RT, anyway.



You said that I said that RT was balanced and fair reporting which I did not. But sure, feel free to make shit up to win your non-argument. The US government absolutely uses the media to manipulate public opinion. Pretty much everyone's at it. Why would you expect the Russians to be any different.


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