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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2016 5:55 pm 
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Of Systemic Importance

Joined: Nov 4, 2011
Posts: 5420
Location: SthDub
1 other issue as told to me by a fiend who works in car insurance.

Claimants who are unable to return to work and are in receipt of disability/illness payments. Insurance companies now have to pay for the first 12 months of these payments whereas in the past it was all borne by the Dept. Social Welfare


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2016 9:09 pm 
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Joined: Dec 2, 2013
Posts: 2213
why do I have to search around for car insurance repeating the same details over and over ?
Why can't I supply my details to a centralised point like motortax.ie and anyone who wants the business can quote me


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2016 9:18 pm 
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Joined: Nov 20, 2014
Posts: 994
GameBlame wrote:
why do I have to search around for car insurance repeating the same details over and over ?
Why can't I supply my details to a centralised point like motortax.ie and anyone who wants the business can quote me


Privacy, data protection etc

Do you really want insurance companies and brokers sharing your info to god knows whom by default?

What you propose makes sence if and only if it is an opt in decision that each motorist takes (with understanding that their data becomes public) and even then legality wise it smells. Let me put it this way, would it not be great if there was a place where people shared their whole lives on and advertisers targeted them (hint Facebook) for some people the answer would be, no, others are used to sharing pictures of private regions :lol: on twitter so they might not see the issue :D


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2016 9:30 pm 
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Joined: Dec 2, 2013
Posts: 2213
satechi wrote:
GameBlame wrote:
why do I have to search around for car insurance repeating the same details over and over ?
Why can't I supply my details to a centralised point like motortax.ie and anyone who wants the business can quote me


Privacy, data protection etc

Do you really want insurance companies and brokers sharing your info to god knows whom by default?

What you propose makes sence if and only if it is an opt in decision that each motorist takes (with understanding that their data becomes public) and even then legality wise it smells. Let me put it this way, would it not be great if there was a place where people shared their whole lives on and advertisers targeted them (hint Facebook) for some people the answer would be, no, others are used to sharing pictures of private regions :lol: on twitter so they might not see the issue :D


Brokers have no role any more !
The side benefit is that my plan destroys McGuire and Co :)


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2016 10:26 pm 
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Posts: 2134
GameBlame wrote:
why do I have to search around for car insurance repeating the same details over and over ?
Why can't I supply my details to a centralised point like motortax.ie and anyone who wants the business can quote me

I did the calling around lark for the first couple of years after I moved back to Ireland. It was easy enough because there were only a couple of companies willing to cover us until we had built up a two year NCB. Then one year I tried Chill.ie and they were able to get better quotes than I was able to get calling the same companies direct. I've used them since. I've checked a company or two each year just to make sure but they've always got me the best deal. They've also switched me each year to get the best deal.

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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2016 5:20 pm 
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Joined: Mar 25, 2008
Posts: 725
Location: North Dublin
JohnnyTheFox wrote:
GameBlame wrote:
why do I have to search around for car insurance repeating the same details over and over ?
Why can't I supply my details to a centralised point like motortax.ie and anyone who wants the business can quote me

I did the calling around lark for the first couple of years after I moved back to Ireland. It was easy enough because there were only a couple of companies willing to cover us until we had built up a two year NCB. Then one year I tried Chill.ie and they were able to get better quotes than I was able to get calling the same companies direct. I've used them since. I've checked a company or two each year just to make sure but they've always got me the best deal. They've also switched me each year to get the best deal.


Are there no price comparison portals that cover car or home insurance? The only portal I know for Ireland is bonkers.ie, and they only cover small subset of insurance market (mortgage protection, live, serious illness).


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:21 pm 
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Single Home Owner

Joined: Jul 8, 2012
Posts: 145
Location: D14
newirishman wrote:
JohnnyTheFox wrote:
GameBlame wrote:
why do I have to search around for car insurance repeating the same details over and over ?
Why can't I supply my details to a centralised point like motortax.ie and anyone who wants the business can quote me

I did the calling around lark for the first couple of years after I moved back to Ireland. It was easy enough because there were only a couple of companies willing to cover us until we had built up a two year NCB. Then one year I tried Chill.ie and they were able to get better quotes than I was able to get calling the same companies direct. I've used them since. I've checked a company or two each year just to make sure but they've always got me the best deal. They've also switched me each year to get the best deal.


Are there no price comparison portals that cover car or home insurance? The only portal I know for Ireland is bonkers.ie, and they only cover small subset of insurance market (mortgage protection, live, serious illness).


Too complex for now - insurers run a divide&conquer scheme with "please bend over" renewal quotes.
[rant]
Motorbike insurance can be very simple in Germany and Austria, see e.g. https://translate.google.com/translate? ... ungen.html
For cars there are three agreed upon risk classes each that all insurers use (TP/FT/Comp) plus regional ones (bigger market). Same classes & region - same quote (TP at least). People check for insurance class before buying - most would actually know the TP class if you ask them...
Insurances would also run continuously, monthly premium only 2-3% extra, big changes only if the classes change.
[/rant]

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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 24, 2016 2:44 pm 
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Joined: Jul 31, 2011
Posts: 1380
Location: 0-71
non transparent sales are a big thing in Ireland...

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Why it was so windy there?... I am out.

For future reference, a 'soft landing' theorem:
06/2007: Central Bank predicts soft landing for housing
http://www.independent.ie/business/iris ... 96858.html
It's all grand


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:10 pm 
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Too Big to Fail
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Joined: Mar 7, 2012
Posts: 3228
Location: Lovely Leitrim
The dump is beyond redemption

Irish insurance spend four times higher than EU average


http://www.irishtimes.com/business/econ ... -1.2811020

Wonder if competition would help lower costs, sure why encourage it

Global motor insurer scraps plans to provide cover in Ireland

AmTrust was required to join MIBI, which must cover cost of collapsed insurer Setanta


http://www.irishtimes.com/business/fina ... -1.2811071

I give up XX

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If Monday was a browser it'd be IE.
Snapchat has replaced facebook as the imbeciles tool of choice.


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:26 pm 
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Joined: Apr 4, 2008
Posts: 2558
Quote:
AmTrust was required to join MIBI, which must cover cost of collapsed insurer Setanta


All (motor) insurers contribute to the MIBI - it covers victims of uninsured drivers. While companies "contribute" they simply load their premiums for the cost i.e. the customer pays (an amount in the region of 4-6% of your premium based on companies I've seen)

The decision to land the MIBI with the Setanta bill was one of such monumental stupidity it stood out even in a country of such decisions weekly. More socialism - don't worry if you make a bad decision and buy your insurance from a fly-by-night operator, if anything bad happens we'll just get everyone else whodidn't fuck up to pay for it

_________________
Borrowers seeking mortgages have had to resort to saving deposits, forcing many to sit by and watch house prices tumble without being able to do anything about it. Sunday Independent - June 1 2008

I know a lot of them, like [Jimmy] Flynn, [Noel] O’Flaherty and the Baileys. You meet the Baileys at Croke Park every time you go there. You can’t avoid getting a slap on the back going in from them. Most of these guys lost their shirt. I feel sorry for them - Bertie Ahern


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:55 pm 
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Real Estate Developer

Joined: Dec 12, 2007
Posts: 880
A large part of this is moronic judges who seem to feel it's good for their charitable image to hand out large settlements.

http://www.claims.ie/end_of_compo_culture

Quote:
A number of personal injury awards by the High Court have been halved by the Court of Appeal, with some criticism of the approach adopted by the original judges.

There have been a run of these reductions lately, experts said, in a sign that judges may be changing their approach to injuries awards, whose size had been leading to a rise in 'compo culture'

Elevated court awards are a factor in the 30pc rise in motor insurance premiums, according to experts.


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:40 pm 
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Too Big to Fail
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Joined: Aug 21, 2009
Posts: 4371
Location: Mesopotatia
sorehead wrote:
A large part of this is moronic judges who seem to feel it's good for their charitable image to hand out large settlements.

http://www.claims.ie/end_of_compo_culture

Quote:
A number of personal injury awards by the High Court have been halved by the Court of Appeal, with some criticism of the approach adopted by the original judges.

There have been a run of these reductions lately, experts said, in a sign that judges may be changing their approach to injuries awards, whose size had been leading to a rise in 'compo culture'

Elevated court awards are a factor in the 30pc rise in motor insurance premiums, according to experts.


You could almost say the size of the awards could be seen as the legal equivalent of clickbait with each judge trying to outdo the other to see how much coverage they can get. The reporting of large awards no doubt acts as an incentive. What I don't see enough of is the reporting of prosecutions for fraud.

The same applies to the scam that is the National Lottery. The lottery winning stories should be accompanied by an interview with Mary who's been playing the same numbers for 50 years and won a cumulative total pf € 270 while spending € 16,000 in the process.

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The real damage is done by those millions who want to 'get by'. The ordinary men who just want to be left in peace. Those who don’t want their lives disturbed by anything bigger than themselves. Those with no sides and no causes. Those who won’t take measure of their own strength, for fear of antagonizing their own weakness. Those people who roll up their spirits into tiny little balls so as to be safe. Safe?! From what?
Sophie Scholl


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 6:59 am 
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Joined: May 12, 2012
Posts: 1817
The narrative is a bit like how people used to go on about monetary policy. "If only we could have slightly lower interest rates we would grow the economy, etc" forgetting that in the long run it is labour productivity alone that determines living standards.

Same for insurance. A lot of gnashing of teeth about competition, levies, capital requirements, etc. In the long run the determinant of costs is the claims environment. This is down to two things: size of claims (by all accounts massive in Ireland) and uninsured drivers (ditto).


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 10:36 am 
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Joined: Apr 4, 2008
Posts: 2558
Capital requirements are harmonised across the EU now (Solvency II)

Straight up in Ireland MIBI levy and insurance levy add probably 11 or 12% to everyone's premium.

Re judges - was at a presentation last year where head of claims for a major company was presenting. Said there were numerous cases where (numbers for illustration only) the company was offering 100k, claimant wanted 200k say. Judge would award an amount way in excess of 200k!

It's also the case that

- there is supposedly a legally defined upper limit for awards for general damages
- if you exaggerate your claim your entitlement falls to zero

Pity nobody told the judges about these little chestnuts.

There's also a number of cases where the policyholder shouldn't be paid due to a policy exclusion. negligence etc. Doesn't stop judges handing them wads however XD

_________________
Borrowers seeking mortgages have had to resort to saving deposits, forcing many to sit by and watch house prices tumble without being able to do anything about it. Sunday Independent - June 1 2008

I know a lot of them, like [Jimmy] Flynn, [Noel] O’Flaherty and the Baileys. You meet the Baileys at Croke Park every time you go there. You can’t avoid getting a slap on the back going in from them. Most of these guys lost their shirt. I feel sorry for them - Bertie Ahern


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 Post subject: Re: Motor Insurance - A Canary?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 8:09 pm 
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Joined: May 12, 2012
Posts: 1817
Renting And Proud! wrote:
Straight up in Ireland MIBI levy and insurance levy add probably 11 or 12% to everyone's premium.

Re judges - was at a presentation last year where head of claims for a major company was presenting. Said there were numerous cases where (numbers for illustration only) the company was offering 100k, claimant wanted 200k say. Judge would award an amount way in excess of 200k!

It's also the case that

- there is supposedly a legally defined upper limit for awards for general damages
- if you exaggerate your claim your entitlement falls to zero

Pity nobody told the judges about these little chestnuts.

There's also a number of cases where the policyholder shouldn't be paid due to a policy exclusion. negligence etc. Doesn't stop judges handing them wads however XD


It is outrageous that you are paying insurance (on top of insurance!) for the inability of the regulators to put manners on the industry. Setanta, Quinn and RSA in recent years. PMPA in the 80s.

Driving without insurance is a completely tractable problem. It simply needs more resources devoted to detection and harsher sentences on conviction. A bit of data science would not go a amiss here - it is probably quite easy to statistically predict who is likely to be driving without insurance.

Judges need to take it seriously too. Multiple offences should mean imprisonment. The current approach of fines and bans just doesn't work.


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