I'm not dismissing principle-driven policy, but it's very difficult to have a useful discussion unless positions are clear.
I suspect that you're deliberately dissembling because you feel that a terse exposition of your views would be controversial, but whatever.
I'll attempt to summarise your last post...
- Foreigners are coming here being exploited by foreign and local businesses (agents, landlords, employers) with state agencies complicit.
- You advocate tightening/enforcing rules to stamp it out, in the interests of those being exploited.
Is that it? Are you exclusively interested in the welfare of the immigrants, or is there some other point that you're hinting at with your "big picture vision"? What is your vision for Ireland in terms of population size and cultural/racial/religious/ethnic mix?
Apologies but Ive been busy for the past two days.
Anyway, Im not sure if youre taking the piss but I referred to a 'grand vision' and you've sought to narrow that down to a tightening of some immigration procedures and an investigation into my predisposition towards the concept of ethnic diversity....I find that quite disappointing....
Anyway, as Ive stated previously, Im more interested in having a discussion about the direction in which Irish society is travelling or rather, the direction in which people would wish to see it travel. I made the point during the course of this thread in particular because the topic seems to be indicative of all that is wrong with the the ideology that has held sway across the western world for the past number of decades ie in the Irish context, four decades after the clearance of the last tenement slums in Dublin, the political and social ideologies that exert power across the institutionalised structures of state and corporate power are engaged in a process whereby such tenement slum conditions are being recreated. A 21st century incarnation of Strumpet City to an extent....
And personally speaking I say fuck that. I dont want it. I want something else. So the point of my post was to seek to perhaps encourage a discussion around what that 'something else' might happen to look like on the part of the educated eggheads around these parts given taht Im really only an oul plebeian....but obviously such nods to the potential of the human imagination are viewed in very suspicious terms in the Ireland of 2017.
So Ill go first. I appreciate that in the context of the world we live in, the following may seem childish or naive....so Id appreciate of you didnt laugh, at least not out loud.....
So PtG's grand vision of a future Ireland would incorporate some of the following....off the top of his head and beginning with matters that could be said to be at least partly derivative of the thread topic....
An island where all human life (in opposition to Minister Coveney's wish/prediction) is not focussed in and around Dublin.....how might such be attained?
An island where there exists opportunities for people not to have to emigrate to find work. How might such be attained?
An island where planning laws take more account of the people who will live in structures rather than those who build them. How might such be attained? edit Open WIndows old vision of larger towns/cities being developed along the lines of the old Georgian Square model (with higher density) sounds good....but maybe its too late already
An island where people had access to decent food at a competitive rate and where obesity levels, especially in children, were greatly reduced. How might such be attained?
An island where the health service was a lot better than it is now. How might such be attained?
A capital city where there wasn't what seems to be an entire generation of working class kids wandering its streets physically and spiritually adrift and dependent on heroin and other such substances. How might such be attained? Indeed, what the fuck is so wrong with this society that it has spawned this horror on such a scale? Furthermore, how in Gods name can a supposedly affluent, western society (if thats what it actually is) of five million people be capable of producing an organised mafia on a scale that is comparable in depravity and viciousness (as well as monetary terms) to similar such outfits from places such as Colombia and Russia? Its actually quite incredible.
Communities where people actually knew their neighbours and looked out for one another rather than living in apartment blocks where nobody knows anybody else, where isolation and suicides (according to Guards) are quite common. Again, how might such be attained?
An island where people (especially the elderly) living in rural communities are supported with proper health and transport facilities and where fear of crime wasnt such an issue for many. How might such be attained?
An island where the elected representatives as well as the state apparatus, rather than seemingly operating to the detriment of the majority and in the interest of the few, actually was fit for purpose. How might such be attained?
An island where local small businesses and community endeavours were encouraged and assisted rather than being taxed and rated to oblivion.....where multi-nationals paid their way....where the prevailing culture that informed the decision making process of legislators emanated from below rather than being a top-down effort....
And where honest debate about issues that change the entire makeup of peoples towns and neighbourhoods, such as mass immigration, could be had in an open and honest manner without being lectured to, sneered at or labelled various 'ist words by others from more salubrious, less 'diverse' parts of town...for what its worth, and in response to what you've asked me about my own attitude to same, I think a degree of immigration into any society is a good thing. I dont however, think that uncontrolled mass inward migration of people who then cluster together in ethnic enclaves as per the norm in some of our neighbours is a good thing. I believe it mitigates against integration and against any genuine inter-cultural exchange and merely creates distrust and future ethnic strife. IMO a proper immigration policy designed to help achieve the goals that this society sets for itself in economic (and, to a degree, from the cultural enhancement of managed immigration) terms would be a good thing and would also result in a better outcome for the 40 or so kids sleeping in the house as per the newspaper article.
Anyway, I could go on all night....but you get the idea...these are notions....I dont expect anyone to do anything other than laugh at most of them. Others here might have hugely different ideas.....which is fine....but to restate, conceiving of policy for its own sake without any 'dream' or vision of where you want to get to is IMO ridiculous....thats what politics does at present....problem is nobody appears to know what they want....so we just keep going round in circles