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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:02 pm 
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mortgageboy wrote:
Coles2 wrote:
And ALL of that foreign capital will again leave taking ALL of it's capital gain with it and ALL of it's income stream until they liquidate their investment.


You can't have it both ways - foreign capital investment has hugely benefited Ireland over decades. Going back to an autarkic economic model would be to step back to the 1950s.

You can have it both ways. You can attract in foreign investment but you can also make bondholders suffer their losses instead of absolving them of it and transferring it all onto the taxpayer.

You can attract in foreign investment without creating specific tax loopholes that only they can avail of that disadvantages domestic capital investment. Fine Gael have completely fucked up this country possibly even to a worse degree than Fianna Fail did. Amazing, but true.


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:03 pm 
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Eschatologist wrote:
I fully support your argument that there is a moral equivalence between living on the dole and retiring to argue on the internet. :D

:lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:24 pm 
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Coles2 wrote:
ps200306 wrote:
Coles2 wrote:
Why can't the State provide a basic level of accommodation? Far cheaper to rent out social housing at affordable levels than to continue to pay private landlords €500 million a year to keep their rents high, €100 million a year on homelessness services, negative health and education impacts for all involved, higher costs of living across the State etc, etc.

What would count as a basic level of accommodation? Honest question -- is social housing not up to the same standard as private tenants have, and wouldn't there be an outcry if it was otherwise? Also, if the State were to build housing for the 64,000 people on rent allowance (40% of them in Dublin) the cost would run to trillions, not hundreds of millions, and they would still have to subsidise people just the same. That doesn't sound very realistic.


Our notion of what is suitable accommodation evolves over time as our expectations change, and the building regulations are in place to reflect that expectation.

If the government built 100,000 house for €100k each it would cost €10 Billion. I have already shown how housing can be built for that cost, and no doubt others could find savings. A €10 Billion capital cost could easily be financed by the €500 million per annum that the government uses to inflate rents, the €100 million spent on homelessness services and by the rent roll of €300-500 million per annum that the properties could generate. If necessary the State could dispose of a portion of the housing to raise further capital for more housing.

I forgot, I must respond to those makey-up figures.


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:31 pm 
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Coles2 wrote:
If the government built 100,000 house for €100k each it would cost €10 Billion. I have already shown how housing can be built for less than that cost and still meet the regs , and no doubt others could find savings.

I somehow managed to slip three extra zeros into my own calculation. :oops:
Ok, point conceded.

Coles2 wrote:
A €10 Billion capital cost could easily be financed by the €500 million per annum that the government uses to inflate rents, the €100 million spent on homelessness services and by the rent roll of €300-500 million per annum that the properties could generate. If necessary the State could dispose of a portion of the housing to raise further capital for more housing.

I doubt the €100 million spent on homelessness services would be saved if, as has been implied, there are a lot of drug addicts and mentally unstable people involved. My own (limited) experience with addicts suggests that some could not manage to pay €5/week out of their dole, nor maintain accommodation in good condition. There will always be a need for emergency accommodation. Regarding the €500m rent roll -- am I wrong in thinking that people currently receiving rent supplement or HAP are already paying as much toward their accommodation as they can afford according to a means assessment. That probably amounts to very little (I don't have numbers) ... so I'm not convinced that 64,000 people could manage to go from paying zero to €400/month to generate your rent roll.

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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:40 pm 
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ps200306 wrote:
I somehow managed to slip three extra zeros into my own calculation. :oops:
Easily done.


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 9:45 pm 
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Coles2 wrote:
ps200306 wrote:
I somehow managed to slip three extra zeros into my own calculation. :oops:
Easily done ps236.


FTFY :D


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:42 pm 
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Did I hear correctly on the radio news that the Peter McVerry Trust was represented in Court in the eviction/injunction proceedings ? If so
1 that's mighty strange
2 he knows who butters his bread.

Coventry McVerry Jesuit link - interesting too


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:59 pm 
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GameBlame wrote:
Did I hear correctly on the radio news that the Peter McVerry Trust was represented in Court in the eviction/injunction proceedings ? If so
1 that's mighty strange
2 he knows who butters his bread.

Coventry McVerry Jesuit link - interesting too


Not as I heard. They stated they were not willing to breach the HC order so kept out before midday today.

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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 12:36 am 
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mr_anderson wrote:
Coles2 wrote:
ps200306 wrote:
I somehow managed to slip three extra zeros into my own calculation. :oops:
Easily done ps236.


FTFY :D

Damn astronomy. Anything within a few orders of magnitude is usually fine. :D

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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:05 am 
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It's over - they're leaving this morning. (Public support was dwindling fast - they're probably quitting at the right time.)

http://www.newstalk.com/Apollo-House-ca ... ourt-today
The occupiers of Apollo House will leave the building this morning.
More than 10 residents were in the building overnight as several returned from alternate accommodation they had been provided.
They will leave the building this morning to comply with the High Court order to vacate.


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:04 am 
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HiFi wrote:
It's over - they're leaving this morning. (Public support was dwindling fast - they're probably quitting at the right time.)

http://www.newstalk.com/Apollo-House-ca ... ourt-today
The occupiers of Apollo House will leave the building this morning.
More than 10 residents were in the building overnight as several returned from alternate accommodation they had been provided.
They will leave the building this morning to comply with the High Court order to vacate.

i havent seen any loss of public support or increase in support for nama et al

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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:15 am 
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werpen wrote:
i havent seen any loss of public support or increase in support for nama et al

Is it one or the other only?


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:19 pm 
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You couldn't make it up. The last man standing in Apollo House was a Pakistani...who refused to leave because he "doesn't like his treatment in Ireland," among other grievances. Perhaps he should head to Ballaghaderreen....

http://www.rte.ie/news/2017/0112/844350-apollo-house/
The last remaining homeless resident of Apollo House has left the building in Dublin's city centre.
The man, who is believed to be from Pakistan, had refused to leave earlier because of a number of grievances about his treatment in Ireland. He also claimed that some of his possessions had been stolen while in Apollo House.


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:39 am 
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HiFi wrote:
You couldn't make it up. The last man standing in Apollo House was a Pakistani...who refused to leave because he "doesn't like his treatment in Ireland," among other grievances. Perhaps he should head to Ballaghaderreen....

http://www.rte.ie/news/2017/0112/844350-apollo-house/
The last remaining homeless resident of Apollo House has left the building in Dublin's city centre.
The man, who is believed to be from Pakistan, had refused to leave earlier because of a number of grievances about his treatment in Ireland. He also claimed that some of his possessions had been stolen while in Apollo House.

I wonder how a homeless Irish person would be looked after in Pakistan.


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 Post subject: Re: Apollo House 'taken over' by Activists
PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:43 am 
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Do you mean looked after in the Al Pacino way or the Julie Walters way?


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