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 Post subject: Ou Sont Les TK Whittakers D'Antan?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 7:51 pm 
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Joined: Apr 27, 2014
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Ballade des Public Servants du Temps Jadis

How much better would the current property and wider economy be if there were people like him involved rather than the current dysfunctional public service more concerned with its own private service, performance managenment, transformation programmes, expert groups, expert reports, tire kicking, buck-passing and can hoofing as national sports and other meaningless shite?

Gaudeamus igitur
Iuvenes dum sumus
Post iucundam iuventutem
Post molestam senectutem
Nos habebit humus

On a separate point, a quick calculation indicates that TK received well over 80 times the contributions he made to his set of defined benefit index linked pensions.


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 Post subject: Re: Ou Sont Les TK Whittakers D'Antan?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:14 pm 
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ChickenParmentier wrote:
Ballade des Public Servants du Temps Jadis

On a separate point, a quick calculation indicates that TK received well over 80 times the contributions he made to his set of defined benefit index linked pensions.


In real or nominal terms?

Please note the man began pension contributions in 1934.


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 Post subject: Re: Ou Sont Les TK Whittakers D'Antan?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:34 pm 
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TK Whitaker was of a time and generation that understood the sacrifice made to achieve independence and placed a huge value on patriotism decency,intelligence and hard work,these old fashioned notions were swept away in the 60s by the likes of Haughey and cronies who corrupted everything in their wake.

I dont honestly think if Whitaker was around today that he would have been able to achieve even a small percent of what he actually achieved, he wouldn't have been able to get past all the brown nosing dullards that jockey for any position in Finance...contrast Whitaker with previous recent incumbents.

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 Post subject: Re: Ou Sont Les TK Whittakers D'Antan?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:44 pm 
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I haven't studied his career but one point made consistently was how he (unusually) crossed a line by trying (and succeeding) to influence an incoming Minister (albeit in difficult times). This emphasizes how strong that line of separation between politics and administration must have been. My sense is that a big problem now is that the line is routinely broken but not by Public Servants interfering in the political but by politicians micro-managing the administrative and by a widespread use of the darker more political arts in relatively routine administrative situations. I suppose the Guards is probably the worst example but we saw many examples during the Crisis of Public Servants knowing instinctively that they were F%4£d if they didn't tell Politicians what they wanted to hear. This is a total breakdown in Governance in my opinion.


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 Post subject: Re: Ou Sont Les TK Whittakers D'Antan?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:20 am 
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Rimbaud wrote:
TK Whitaker was of a time and generation that understood the sacrifice made to achieve independence and placed a huge value on patriotism decency,intelligence and hard work,these old fashioned notions were swept away in the 60s by the likes of Haughey and cronies who corrupted everything in their wake.

I dont honestly think if Whitaker was around today that he would have been able to achieve even a small percent of what he actually achieved, he wouldn't have been able to get past all the brown nosing dullards that jockey for any position in Finance...contrast Whitaker with previous recent incumbents.


FFS. The only reason the Whitaker plan was allowed to see the light of day is because that generation that you seem to think so highly of had run the country completely into the ground in the previous 20 years, leaving it facing imminent demographic and economic collapse by the mid 1950's. DeValeras immense bovine stupidity in the 1930's and 1940's being compounded by Sean MacBrides even more breathtakingly arrogant incompetence in the late 1940's / early 1950's. They had turned what had been one of the poorer regions of the richest country in the world into one of the poorest regions in western Europe. A pariah state treated little differently than the losing Axis states of WW2. In the space of five years MacBride turned the only state that ended the war undamaged, with a huge surplus and readily sellable goods into an economic basket case shunned even by the Marshall Plan. Even Switzerland ended up getting more aid than Ireland. All due to MacBrides "700 years of oppression" bullshit when most of western europe was still in ruins and millions still living in rubble. In the diplomatic terms of the 1940's MacBride was told to go fuck himself and all future aid was cut off.

Another high point in modern Irish history that the academic historians seem loath to delve into too deeply.

If you think Haughey and the men in the mohair suits invented modern political corruption then you know little of the mysterious millions (yes millions) that the DeVelara family and the other first generation "patriots" acquired during their political careers. In the history of the state "patriot" and "corruption" have always been synonymous.

Lemass and those around him only accepted Whitaker plan, a complete reversal of all their previous dearly held political positions, because they had absolutely no other alternative by that stage if they wanted to hang onto political power and the spoils it entailed.It was only when they were presented with the disastrous demographic projections by the Dept of Finance due to mass emigration that the politicians finally blinked. You cannot have political spoils to distribute if you have fewer and fewer taxpayers to fleece. The good of the country had absolutely nothing to do with it.

And real reform of the current state will only happen when the time comes again, which it will, when the politicians are left with absolutely no other alternative to complete collapse and ruin. Which given recent events may be far sooner than everyone around here seems to think. Current state finances make Anglo in 2006 look like a paragon of financial rectitude in comparison.


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 Post subject: Re: Ou Sont Les TK Whittakers D'Antan?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:39 am 
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While the FF'ers line up to claim credit for following his plan (which to be fair they did). He was appointed as Secretary of the Department of Finance by the previous Coalition government. Gerald Sweetman must have ruffled a few feathers when he elevated a 39 year old to head the department of Finance.

You have to wonder how he slipped through the net.

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