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 Post subject: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:34 pm 
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I think a repository thread would be useful for readers who happen on the site or seek it out to learn about NAMA but don't know where to start here because of the variety of discussions and the level of analysis. For people who want to know the details and read the opinions of 'experts.' And then draw their own conclusions.

It will save hours of irritating googling and confusion and will be an interesting archive and resource when this too has passed.

The purpose of this thread is not to discuss articles but for members to post up links to articles, videos and audio that might be of use to readers who find their way here through the Facebook campaign, for example and want to to get some information about NAMA.

Maybe a short outline of what the article is about, the author and the perspective of the writer would help. Archives or current material welcome.

edit: Rather than having too many individual posts that might be hard to follow, I'm going to group them all together under post headings - So there'll be a Liam Carroll and NAMA post, an Alan Ahearne post, a Builders' Interest post and as articles etc arise, I'll keep them together.

This thread should make it as easy as possible to read and access information. PM me if you want something included or simply post it and I'll copy it to the relevant post.

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Thu Aug 20, 2009 10:38 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:35 pm 
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The Brendan Keenan Post
This post will contain articles written by Brendan Keenan, Group Business Editor of Independent Newspapers,

1.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/colum ... 48801.html

from May 23 - weighing up the possible pitfalls before the legislation was published.

Basic summary of what NAMA is about.

2. http://www.independent.ie/opinion/colum ... 61297.html

NAMA may not be a loss making venture (refers to cycles in property prices). August 17

Quote:
But I do not see that Nama is intrinsically a loss-making venture, as so many seem to suggest.

There is, somewhere, a price which will make it self-financing. But it must start with the research showing that a bad property-fuelled banking crisis can cost up to 30 per cent of GDP -- €50bn in our case.

It may not be necessary to embark on the project with such an ultra-pessimistic view of the outcome. But the Nama valuations must be based on a pessimistic view, not optimistic. If this is not the approach, the citizens may indeed lose in the end or -- perhaps worse -- face immediate crisis because the whole thing falls apart politically.

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Thu Aug 20, 2009 10:56 am, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:38 pm 
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www.irisheconomy.ie

Very useful website featuring articles by well-known economists followed by discussions which tease out the issues.

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:43 pm 
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Panel Discussions - Radio and TV

1.
Ivana Bacik, Justine McCarthy, Carl O’Brien and Paul Anthony McDermott on Today (with Myles Dungan) on Friday 14 August discussing NAMA and related issues.

The discussion considers the status of the property industry, ACC and Liam Carroll and the implications of recent developments in the courts, Ivana Bacik against NAMA, Media’s ‘gleeful’ pursuit of developers? Canadian bank interest in AIB,

http://www.rte.ie/radio/liveplayer_av.h ... adio1.smil

starts at about 1.25 and lasts to 1.39 ish.

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Thu Aug 20, 2009 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:51 pm 
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Brian Lucey on NAMA

Who is he? Associate Professor in Finance at TCD.
http://people.tcd.ie/blucey
Articles written by him will be collated here.

1.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opi ... 09852.html

In this article (published on May 18 before the draft legislation was published) he suggests that Fine Gael's alternative to NAMA - to create a National Recovery Bank, is a better idea.


2.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opi ... 52071.html - published August 1.

And this is what he has to say since the legislation was published -'country's future mortgaged on sloppy, confused legislation.'


There are some responses to the article here

http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/20 ... gislation/

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Thu Aug 20, 2009 10:42 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:54 pm 
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deleted

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Thu Aug 20, 2009 10:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:11 pm 
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Michael Somers, NTMA and NAMA

Michael Somers is head of the National Treasury Management Agency which will oversee NAMA.

1.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/fin ... 68484.html

On May 15 he had concerns about the impending legislation and how NTMA would cope with the workload.

2.
More recently, it was announced that NAMA will act on loans before Christmas

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0723/economy1.html

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Thu Aug 20, 2009 10:45 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:22 pm 
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Repost from here: viewtopic.php?p=286111#p286111

The Swedish experience of bad banks:
yoganmahew wrote:
Seeing as there is a lot of stuff about the Swedish bad banks, here's some indigestion material.

Starting with my favourite:
http://www.clevelandfed.org/research/PO ... /pdp21.pdf
A review by the Cleveland Fed. on Securum, the main vehicle for resolving the nationalised Nordbanken's bad loan book.

Bank of England review on the Causes and Management of Banking Crises:
http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/educatio ... bshb12.pdf

Bank of England review on the Resolution of Banking Crises:
http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/publicat ... 15art6.pdf

Financial statements for Venatius which provide a little more Swedish colour:
http://www.venantius.se/pdf/arsredov_06_eng.pdf
Venatius was another bad bank formed from tenants associations and other companies that had been directly funded by the Swedish state. Think of it as a bad bank for the councils and the HFA... Note that Venatius took on the last 6 billion krona of Securum's assets when Securum was wound up in 1997, paying the princely sum of 2.6 bn krona for them. Venatius was, I believe, wound up in 2007.

Arne Bergren's comments at an FDIC Symposium:
http://www.fdic.gov/bank/historical/man ... ym1-09.pdf
Quote:
We had to make a big quick fix for Nordbanken. However, it
was soon clear that the quick fix was not enough. So we decided to nationalize the bank
and recapitalize it. Nordbanken was very large, as its asset base equaled 23 percent of
GDP. The initial cost of recapitalizing Nordbanken equaled 3 percent of GDP. A few
years later we were able turn it around at a profit for the taxpayers and that transaction,
more or less, paid for the banking crisis.

Anglo is the bank that is in the position that Nordbanken was in. Securum was the vehicle set up to manage it's bad loans. So let's look at the Anglo position:
- Anglo amounts to some 40% of GDP.
- It has been recapitalised to the tune of 2.2% of GDP.
- It alone would provide a bad bank the size of Securum.

Securum got an initial capital bung of 24 bn krona (4.5 bn US dollars in 1997 dollars) and returned 14 bn krona by 1997 (1.8 bn US dollars). It therefore made a 60% loss in constant currency terms on the loans it took on. Need I remind anyone that we are in the euro so it is not possible for us to inflate our figures in this way.

It is likely, in my view, that the Anglo loan book will similarly lose 60% of its initial value. I believe the loan book at the time of nationalisation was 72 bn (?), implying an overall loss of 43.2 bn, some of which has already been taken and some of which will be lessened by inflation over the time the workouts happen. (Good thing we are in inflationary times). Personally, I don't see a cleaned up Anglo having a franchise value of 43+ bn euro. Perhaps I am just an old stick in the mud...

Anyway, my point in doing this is to scotch the notion that seems to be prevalent that the Swedes made money on their bad bank. I can see no evidence that they did. I can see plenty of unattributed mainstream media references to this, but none backed by peer reviewed works.

Anyone with any other relevant info on these or any of the other bad banks in Sweden, please post.


and

songster wrote:
Interesting read.. don't know if it has been posted before.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/23/busin ... krona.html


Quote:Then came the imperative to bleed shareholders first. Mr. Lundgren recalls a conversation with Peter Wallenberg, at the time chairman of SEB, Sweden’s largest bank. Mr. Wallenberg, the scion of the country’s most famous family and steward of large chunks of its economy, heard that there would be no sacred cows.

The Wallenbergs turned around and arranged a recapitalization on their own, obviating the need for a bailout. SEB turned a profit the following year, 1993.

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"It is impossible to design a system so perfect that no one needs to be good."

So long and thanks for all the fish.


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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:11 am 
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Nama's website
http://www.nama.ie
with two FAQ's
http://www.nama.ie/Publications/2009/NAMAFAQs.pdf
http://www.nama.ie/Publications/2009/NA ... stions.pdf

Could the pin do a rebuttal of the FAQ answers, perhaps.


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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 4:15 pm 
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OT (for this thread) posts split to here: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=24258

Let's keep this for reference items related to NAMA and have discussion elsewhere.

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"It is impossible to design a system so perfect that no one needs to be good."

So long and thanks for all the fish.


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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 7:39 pm 
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Another link if anyone is interested.

http://notonama.blogspot.com/

Have signed the petition ( the more the merrier!) :wink: Don't think it has been posted anywhere yet.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:43 am 
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Patrick Honohan
Patrick Honohan is Professor of International Financial Economics and Development at Trinity College.

1.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opi ... 79786.html

Here he suggests (August 6) that shareholders should take some of the risk to reduce the risk to taxpayers.

Quote:
Improved risk-sharing could be achieved in a number of ways. One simple approach is to have Nama make only part of the payment for the acquired assets in the form of bonds, with the remainder being made in the form of a claim on Nama’s future recoveries.

Thus, there would be a two-part payment. One part, representing the basic price that can confidently be expected to be attainable, should be paid in bonds. For the rest, the shareholders of the banks (and possibly other providers of risk capital to the banks) should be paid in the form of an equity stake in Nama’s future recoveries.


Quote:
It will take more than Nama to get the banking system back on its feet and to re-establish its collective nerve to provide the lending and other financial services needed to support the economic recovery. But, properly set-up and functioning well, Nama could be a key ingredient.

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Thu Aug 20, 2009 10:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:46 am 
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Green Party Responses and Reactions to NAMA

1.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ire ... 80132.html
In today's Irish Times, Dan Boyle, Finance Spokesperson for the Green Party suggests that changes be made to protect the Irish taxpayer.

Quote:
Mr Boyle said he favoured amending the Bill to give more protection to the taxpayer along the lines advocated in The Irish Times by Prof Patrick Honohan of Trinity College. “The main concerns that the public have is that the exposure for the taxpayer is huge and there are legitimate questions about how the risk the taxpayer is being exposed to can be properly managed and shared,” Mr Boyle said earlier on RTÉ Radio’s This Week programme.

He said bank shareholders had to be involved in the risk because ultimately they were the people who would benefit. “If taxpayers’ money is going into such a process we have to make sure that the taxpayer is exposed for the smallest amount of time and the smallest amount of money and the legislation as it is written now needs to be tightened up in those areas in particular,” he said.

“The danger of Nama is that it could set an artificial floor on the price of property. We think that would repeat many of the mistakes that got us into the difficulty we are now in – [in] terms of an over reliance on property and development,” he said.



Pin discussion of that here
viewtopic.php?f=50&t=24274

2.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/bre ... ng149.html

Greens see dangers in NAMA

August 16
Quote:
"If taxpayers money is going into such a process we have to make sure that the taxpayer is exposed for the smallest amount of time and the smallest amount of money and the legislation as it is written now needs to be tightened up in those areas in particular," he said.

"The danger of Nama is that it could set an artificial floor on the price of property. We think that would repeat many of the mistakes that got us into the difficulty we are now in. terms of an over reliance on property and development," he said.


3. Green reaction to NAMA and what that may mean...

http://www.rte.ie/news/news1pm/player.h ... 9,real,209

News at One August 13
Green Councillors give opinion on NAMA
If the Green Party doesn't support NAMA, it won't go through Dáil - Stephen Collins of Irish Times

4. Green Party support for NAMA not to be taken for granted, says Boyle
on Morning Ireland 240809

http://www.rte.ie/news/morningireland/p ... 9,real,209

and reported here

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/bre ... king27.htm

[Legislation to establish the National Asset Management Agency (Nama) is "difficult" for many Green supporters and is "directly opposed" to the party's "philosophical bent" finance spokesman Dan Boyle said today.

However, he warned that any alternatives to the Bill would inflict even "bigger damage on the country in the long-term".

Speaking on RTÉ's Morning Ireland Mr Boyle said the Government is not presenting the Nama legislation as a fait accompli but are taking a "consultative approach".[/quote]

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Tue Aug 25, 2009 11:28 am, edited 4 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:51 am 
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Builders' Interest
Posts relating to the Construction Industry Federation and the Irish Home Builders Association will be stored here.

1.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ire ... 80108.html

This article is low on actual information but it points out that builders have concerns about NAMA.

Hubert Fitzpatrick, Director of the Irish Home Builders Association says

Quote:
Mr Fitzpatrick said it was understandable that the new legislation should wish to guard against those who might try to impede the effective operation of Nama. “However, the draft Bill envisages that Nama will have powers so extensive, over-reaching and beyond challenge that individual rights may be seriously impeded,” he said.

He also said there was a need for a package of interim measures to make credit available across the economy, until Nama was up and running.

“Since the announcement of Nama in April, the banks have been effectively closed for business to all sectors,” Mr Fitzpatrick said.

“Many bank loans will not be transferred to Nama for up to six to nine months. This lapse of time will bring much uncertainty and lack of clarity in relation to funding requirements for these businesses, jeopardising employment and local economic activity.”

Mr Fitzpatrick said a solution was urgently needed to facilitate the working capital requirements of many builders and contractors.


Pin discussion of that here
viewtopic.php?f=50&t=24275

2.
http://www.rte.ie/news/news1pm/player.h ... 9,real,209

Tom Parlon, of Construction Industry Federation re NAMA on the News at 1 today - for developers and builders, NAMA "is the only way forward" but they have concerns about the legislation and are in consultation with their builder and developer members.

3.


Hubert Fitzpatrick of Homebuilder's Association saying that rights of individuals are being affected because they have no choice whether their loans go into NAMA.

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Thu Aug 20, 2009 11:05 am, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: All You Ever Wanted to Know about NAMA - The Repository
PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:00 am 
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Protests against NAMA

Groups against NAMA from all angles...
1.

http://www.rte.ie/radio1/player_av.html ... esday.smil
1.18 mins in

Wednesday, 19 August. Radio 1's Drivetime presents a package on No to Nama demonstrations. Included are The Irish People's Union represented by Dave Browne (lots of discussion on this site), and the United Alliance Against Cuts, Paul Sheils.

_________________
“The only calibration that counts is how much heart people invest, how much they ignore their fears of being hurt or caught out or humiliated. And the only thing people regret is that they didn't live boldly enough, that they didn't invest enough heart, didn't love enough. Nothing else really counts at all.” Ted Hughes

“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” Anais Nin


Last edited by Kate P on Thu Aug 20, 2009 11:17 am, edited 2 times in total.

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